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thanks. I though my car would have a nice rough idle with the solid cam with a tight LSA I put in my car, its go a slight lope to it, but it pulls hard. Yeah but do the experiment on the dyno and tell me your intuition is correct.
Full text of "Pediatric Books" We even treated them to some chamber work before installation. Lobe separations on 383-406 cids.104-106-108-110? When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. But for small-block Chevys (like the LS applications in this story), the LSA is ground into the cam. Pretty much standard for an RV type cam. 03 The 4.000-inch crank and 6.125-inch rods were combined with a set of forged asymmetrical pistons from JE. i've heard of this being done something about the massive amounts of duration allowes gasses to disipate? *If you do not have enough vacuum, you can in some cases install a vacuum canister or reservoir, which works by storing the peak vacuum in the reservoir. Valve lift will bear weight in any decision regarding LSA. With minimal overlap and a steady manifold vacuum signal, they work great with fuel-injection systems and are the norm on modern pushrod engines, such as the LS and Gen III hemi. In my opinion, the rougher the idle the better! [img]http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/downsideup09/DSCF2616-1.jpg[/img], [img]http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs139.snc1/5928_111214857139_110806152139_2127222_6826389_n.jpg[/img]. Retarding the camshaft (a higher intake lobe centerline number 108 vs. 104) will generally start the power band later in the RPM range and decrease the cylinder pressure. 554"/577" lift. If you look at any given cam catalog, you will find that the majority of street-oriented cams fall in this range. Again, these are general bits of conventional wisdom. Tight LSA cams make excellent low-end torque and have a beautiful power curve. by mike thompson Tue May 13, 2003 4:03 am, Post Our content is merely suggestive, not intended to use without proper safety precautions and advice. How do the lobe separations change when you factor in turbocharging? Given that nitrous works best in the mid- to upper-rpm range, nitrous-powered engines need a wider lobe separation, like 112 . 112 vs 114 lobe centers You cannot tell the differance in the two . too much for the street? OK, what is hydraboost, and how do you like how the cam performs??? Post
106 Lobe Separation Angle | The De Tomaso Forums Not a HUGE, but a significant difference between 110 and 112, but those are the trends. 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is a wider LSA with almost no overlap. Anybody here run a 108 LSA? I just bought a 86b Webcam with 112 lobe centers for my 2276. Some prefer a narrow powerband, and some prefer the broader one. It's wet flow tested at 690cfm. 2.1.2.4.2 Side-lobe suppression shall be provided in accordance with the provisions of 3.1.2.1.5.2.1 on all Mode S-only all-call interrogations. " - Voltaire. LSA is the distance from the centerline of the intake lobe to the centerline of exhaust lobe. To establish the position of each lobe, the traditional reference point is where the lobes reach max lift. The 112-degree cam offered nearly all the low-speed and mid-range torque of the 108 cam but the peak power suffered above 5,200 rpm. It is the average centerline between both lobes and expressed in degrees ranging from 95 on the extremely narrow/tight side to upward of 120 on the wide end. music to your ears? However, finding them might be challenging if you dont have any prior knowledge. But, the narrow or broad powerband choice varies from person to person. Although both wide (112-116) and narrow (102-110) lobe separation angles do have an effect on overlap, it's still possible to get a lot of overlap with very wide lobe separation angle cams. Generally, naturally aspirated engines run narrower lobe separation angles of around 106 to 108 whereas supercharged, turbo or nitrous engines operate with 112 to 114 and higher.
What real difference does the lsa on a cam make? . According to the Comp Cams catalog, "The lobe separation angle (LSA) is equal to 1/2 the angle in crankshaft degrees of rotation between the maximum exhaust valve lift and maximum intake lift.". ( 2 ) Estimated Ship Date: Feb 23, 2023 (if ordered today) Drop Ship. by mrsmythe Mon May 12, 2003 11:15 am, Post
I think that cam had 110 lobe sep. Im loking at a summit cam with close to the same lift and duration #s but 114 lobe sep. Thanks again. 110 LSA: On the contrary, at 110 LSA, the engine fails to reach the maximum torque, resulting in a decrease in torque rate.
Attenuation of Seizures, Cognitive Deficits, and Brain Histopathology turbo camshafts lobe centers and lobe separation To overcome this inherent problem in wide LSA camshafts, you simply need a higher-flowing intake port. If it occurs too late, it will lean out the cylinder and greatly hinder the performance of the engine. Like one cam is 112 degree and the next is 108 the 108 cam will allow less "leakage"? To further minimize any dyno variations, the engine's oil and water temperatures were kept the same for each pull.
Lobe Separation Angle - Restoration and Repair Help NOTE: Classic Inlines stocks the above profiles in 108, 110, and 112 lobe centers. LSA is a result of valve timing events. Walter Noah is a process engineer who has a knack for resolving even the toughest technical issue. Tests 2 and 3 meant dissecting the motor on the dyno to get the old cam out. The tighter the lobe center, the lower the RPM range; the wider the lobe center, the higher the RPM range. The 120-degree cam minimized torque production through most of the curve, while the 112-degree cam offered more torque but slightly less peak power.
108 vs 112 lobe seperation - Shoptalkforums.com Similarly, 110 LSA is also found to be a more fabulous performer in several mechanical aspects. Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main Culprit, Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything], Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? Tuning this cam would be slightly more difficult due to the reduced idle vacuum, but it is hard to argue with all the extra power. For any additional clarification or questions please contact our Tech Line at 714 523-0530. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57gfBu8uc6k&t=1s. by mrsmythe Wed May 14, 2003 2:26 am, Post dur. by Kdub Sun Dec 07, 2008 1:20 am, Post
Myoinositol reduction in medial prefrontal cortex of obsessive But, the internal processings are much more complicated. Now that we have a basic understanding of lobe separation angle, we can put together a test to illustrate just what happens when you make changes to it. 106 LSA: 106LSA results in a decrease in piston-to-valve clearance. Whatever you do, stay under 270 advertised duration and shoot for a 110 lobe separation. It made 472.4 lb-ft at peak, a 21.5lb-ft disparity from the 101 cam. A forum community dedicated to Ford performance owners and enthusiasts. 106 LSA: So, if I talk about the powerband at 106 LSA, the powerband is narrow. It is possible to advance and retard the timing events, but the distance between the centerline of the lobes will remain constant. Well, there can be different reasons for this problem. Check out the Comp Cams catalog, even the biggest hydraulic rollers use 110. 108 Lobe Separation These are my motors specs 1979 - 347 Stroker 10:1 Compression Holley 670 Street Avenger or a Holley 650 (I have both) Roush 200 Cylinder Heads (minor head work) 1.6 Roller Rockers Shorty BBK Headers 373 Rear End 5 Speed Transmission Cross Gap Intake (Power Band 1500-6500) FlowMaster Dual Exhaust (of course no Cats) MSD 6Al
Cam Advise - 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum It really comes down to the application. To reiterate another point, I realize that wider LSAs tend to broaden the power band, but for a car I would like to bracket race a bit, as well as enjoy on the street, I was told that a narrower LSA will help the car accelerate at a faster rate. any input is appreciated guys, thanks. The first cam featured a wide 120-degree LSA, while cam number two narrowed the angle to 112 degrees. What happens when you change ONLY.
So the wider LSA introduces a broader and therefore longer torque band.. When boost or nitrous are introduced, and engine builders contemplate choices between single-, dual- or reverse-pattern camshafts then the discussion gets muchmore technical. I have 108 for LSA and my headlights take awhile to go up when the car is idling. It may not display this or other websites correctly. A good amount of idle vacuum or increased idle vacuum found at 110 LSA advances the engines efficiency. If identical and for a given displacement the 110 will give more power. Thanks for the replies so far. An RV or towing camshaft, which is considered a mild performance or an economy cam, will often have a narrower LSA, between 112 and 114 degrees. 15,215. ohio. According to the Motortrend, LSA (Lobe Separation Angle) is a wonderful approximation of the operation of the engine because it takes into account the relative time of the intake-valve events (intake opening, intake closing) and the exhaust-valve events (exhaust opening, exhaust closing) concerning each other.Above mentioned sequential activities allow LSA to be an accurate representation of the operation of the engine. I've heard similar cams (only about 5*'s off) and they have a nice rumble to them. My engine shop builds all kinds of hot rod motors, and they told me that because I am running a 4 speed manual, I will better be able to take advantage of the 108 LSA. It had a robust powerband with tons of usable torque. by Hoxviii Mon May 12, 2003 7:50 pm, Post In terms of horsepower, the disparity between all three cams was only 6.5 hp, with a scant 100 rpm separating the peaks. Methods: We evaluated 30 individuals with PD (62.47.2 years) and 22 age-matched healthy controls (61.06.4 years).
Camshaft Shootout: Lobe-Separation Angle Tested and Explained - MotorTrend Another related thought to consider when selecting a cam is inches of vacuum for your engine application when deciding upon a Lobe Center. A 232 deg duration cam with a 108 deg LCA will have the same valve overlap as a 236 deg cam with a 110 deg LCA and idle will probably be very similar. Either learn to fix it, or learn to write checks. If you shift at 7500-7800 add 4-6 degrees to both intake and exhaust and spread the lobe separation to 108-110. I know a little about cams. Re: Lobe separations on 383-406 cids.104-106-108-110. 106 LSA: At 106 LSA, the cylinder pressure is a bit higher. Engine builders Chuck Lawrence, left, and Doug Patton. While lift and duration are most often discussed when talk turns to cam timing, there is a third variable that has a decided effect on both power and personality. 106 LSA: There is an increasing chance of engine knock at the 106 lobe separation angle. by trmnatr Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:45 pm, Post Lobe Separation Angle, or LSA, is the number of degrees that separate the peak lift points of the cam's intake and exhaust lobes. A cam with a 112 lobe center will pull approximately 16-20" of vacuum, which is good for power brakes. 106 LSA: The scale of efficient compression rises at 106 LSA. After spending 8 years in plant production engineering, Noah wanted to join Engine Addiction as a key member of all cars specific guides, reviews, repairs, suggestions, and more.
Camshafts Demystified - CarTechBooks Equipped with the 120-degree (LSA) cam, the hybrid stroker produced 570 hp at 6,200 rpm and 535 lb-ft of torque at 5,200 rpm. Some of the confusion on this subject comes from what the meaning of "bottom" and "top" is to the speaker, I suppose. The intake lobe centerline is measured in crankshaft degrees. It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong. We will also custom grind any of the above profiles with a custom lobe center, for an additional $20 dollars. Read More Chevy 350 Ignition Coil Location And Everything About ThemContinue, What causes a car to bog down when accelerating? but less of it at the same time. What brand and what are the specs on your cam, 4-linked72? If you look at the cam card, you will find a maximum lift column on the card.Now, all you have to do is, add up the two mentioned maximum angles and divide the summation by 2. The 112-degree cam (red lines) picked up much of the torque, but the big winner was the cam with the tightest lobe separation angle. from the intake to the exhaust and vise-versa.Thats why a performance cam will usually have a rougher idle than a stock one. Depending on the engine combination, the opposite results can occur. Since we were only changing the lobe separation angle, we had to make sure every variable (air/fuel, timing, water, air, and oil temps) was identical during testing. If that were the only consideration, the 101 cam is the clear winner. "When you've properly tuned a performance motor, you create high- and low-pressure waves in the intake and exhaust that help cylinder filling," said Comp Cams' Billy Godbold. Its the shifting problem again with your Chevy! The takeaway is simple on the surface: A tighter LSA makes more low-end and peak torque at the expense of just a few top-end ponies. . LSA helps determine the cam's behavior; you can take a given set of lift and duration figures, change the LSA, and get cams with vastly different characteristics. So, you can enjoy a mighty acceleration power at 110 LSA. 108* or narrower lobe separation angle (LSA) is "Narrow" and 114* or wider (up to 117* or 120* for stock cams) is "Wide" , with 110 to 112* being the "normal" hot-rod cam. by Marc Mon May 12, 2003 11:38 am, Post We'll send you raw engine tech articles, news, features, and videos every week from EngineLabs. Lobe sepsration is an advanced description for overlap.If you take a cam on a 112,and grind it on a 108,you add more overlap,the time the valves are both open.Narrower lobe centers mean more low end and midrange torque,along with a peakier powerband,and a slightly rougher idle.Tradeoffs are sensitivity to octane ratings,total timing, and air fuel ratio.A lot to swallow I know,hope this helps you. whats the difference in how the car will run. 08 Additional components used to build the stroker included a set of Comp hydraulic roller lifters, ARP head studs, and a new oil pump. You can research your heads to find out where yours are, but honestly I don't think it will be worth the effort on a tow vehicle. Tight lobe separations, such as 108 or shorter, will cause the peak torque to build earlier in the RPM range and peak-out in a short amount of . If you want a lumper idle go with a cam with 108 LSA, the tigher the LSA the idle will be rougher. If you take any of the . The 108-degree cam (blue lines) outperformed the other two, but idle quality suffered. For Example: A 110-degree lobe separation means that the peak opening points of the Intake and Exhaust lobes is 110 degrees apart. changing just the LSA on my cam wouldnt make a bit of difference on vacuum operated items E ericnova72 More for Less Racer Joined Jan 13, 2007 22,026 Posts LS Exhaust Manifold Bolt Torque (Everything You Need To Know), Holley Power Valve Sizes: Everything There is to Know. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
A narrower lobe separation angle can provide less power but can also lead to less wear. probably just enough to get me in trouble.. The valve covers, valvetrain, intake manifold, harmonic balancer, front cover, timing set, and cam were yanked. camshaft is a Cranecams F238. 12 In terms of power production, the stroker LS3 performed best with the tightest lobe separation angle. Also If you go with 112 lobe centers, you create less valve overlap which will increase your compretion. Thats just the way the customer wants to roll, and engine builders find its easy to deliver such a powerplant. I have used some cut on a 110 that worked well too, but they never sounded as good as the tight ones. by flat4racer17 Mon May 12, 2003 1:40 pm, Post The lower the lobe seperation,, ie. On the surface, the camshaft's job is simpleopen and close the valvesbut beyond that topical description, it's one of the most mysterious and misunderstood engine components. kinda off topic.. but while we're on the topic of cams, duration,lift,ect has anybody heard of using high compreshion (13:1) on pump gas, by useing alot of duration? also,, wider will produce a wider and more flat torque curve that doesn't fall off as abruptly up top rpms. JavaScript is disabled. I had an XE 274 in it. its got a 3.73 posi and the Stock 4 speed with a very low 3.42 1st gear. General topics - 76 LA built, CA car with m20. But, after comparing these two LSA based on a few mechanical aspects, such as maximum Torque, RPM, powerband, oil consumption, and many more, you will find the 106 LSA with better performance output. If the overlap phase occurs too early, it will create an overly rich condition in the exhaust port, severely decreasing the gas mileage. Hey guys, can anyone tell me how rough of a idle a cam would be with a 108 lobe separation? The lobe separation angle is a comprise of what the engine needs depending on the compression, combustion chamber, rpm, engine size, head volume, and many, many other variables.
Defining Lobe Center - Clay Smith Cams As lobe seperation spreads does the powerband. "Ninety-nine percent of cranking compression is dictated by static compression ratio and intake-valve closing point," said Comp Cams' Billy Godbold. by Mr. P. Fri Dec 12, 2008 6:36 pm, Powered by phpBB Forum Software phpBB Limited, General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track. You can modify the lobe center a little bit but not enough to change the actual overlap of the grind.
lobe separation angle | For A Bodies Only Mopar Forum You must log in or register to reply here. These numbers can vary a few inches one way or the other, depending on several other aftermarket factors and your individual engine specifications, so you may want to check your vacuum once the cam is installed. If that accessory still does not assist the cam in producing enough vacuum, then as a last resort you can use a vacuum pump. . Tests have shown that, for a given cam profile, a tighter (smaller) lobe center will produce more average horsepower and a quicker revving engine. 04 Minor modifications to the factory windage tray were necessary to work with the new stroker assembly.
Camshaft Lobe Seperation | Team Chevelle The 108-degree cam offered both the most power and torque, but idle quality suffered compared to the wider LSAs. I've seen that Webcam cams can be ordered with either of the above. That was just a glimpse of the information you were looking for. At a lower LSA, the engine reaches the peak of the torque earlier than the standard time but generates a lower RPM.On the contrary, at a higher LSA, the engine reaches the peak torque at a higher resistance level and generates a bulk number of RPM.
106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle: Real Impacts You Must Learn But that doesnt mean high-strung racing engines cant see gains, as well. Making this the biggest obstacle to overcome when selecting a cam profile with one of our tech advisors, explaining the definition and importance of the Lobe Center. Tests have shown that, for a given cam profile, a tighter (smaller) lobe center will produce more average horsepower and a quicker revving engine. I also like the 106 lobe separation with the intake on 103. Higher lift and longer duration profiles add power, but do so at higher engine speeds (especially true of duration). I would have to say that your cam choice sounds like a winner to me. It should still make close to 600hp and 600tq in my 512" stealth headed big block. by lazaris Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:18 pm, Post LSA is a way of summing up the relative timing of the intake-valve events (intake opening, intake closing) to the exhaust-valve events (exhaust opening, exhaust closing) in relation to each other, and it's a great approximation of how the engine will operate. For large port heads like the CNC 044's which can use the extra lift 1.4's make a noticable difference. = Extremely Tight . The 110o will make more power overall. 05 To ensure our stroker combo had sufficient airflow, we installed a set of Chevrolet Performance CNC-ported LS3 heads from Gandrud Chevrolet. 112-110 Deg. JavaScript is disabled. 108 versus 110 will drive the power band down. LSA CAM TEST-108 vs 112 vs 120 Richard Holdener 239K subscribers 168K views 2 years ago WESTECH PERFORMANCE GROUP FULL RESULTS-CHANGE ONLY LSA-LS CAM TEST. Looking at 108vs. by farmer Mon May 12, 2003 3:14 pm, Post It will sound lovely I'm sure. Once more the engine came apart to install the third test cam, a 107 LSA.
Lunati's New Bootlegger Camshaft Series Has Strong Race - Dragzine Lobe separation angles, he continues, are influenced by the camshaft grind. 110 LSA) and Crane's #341191 (238/248, .563"/.587", 114 LSA), display considerably different characteristics. by bigjoe1 Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:48 pm, Post Fixing the ignition coils is essential when you experience issues like engine misfire and the Check Engine light that wont go off. (You can find an instructional video of how to do just that on our Clay Smith Cams YouTube Channel;https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57gfBu8uc6k&t=1s ). The final cam was tighter still, with a 108-degree LSA. The 114 cam will give more low end torque, good midrange, less power up high. So, now you, Read More Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main CulpritContinue, While changing the oil on your boats lower unit, you may need to change the drain plug, too.
Known as "The Gladiator" around Westech Performance, this Dart SHP blockbased, 370ci, small-block Chevy has made thousands of dyno pulls testing all manner of heads, intakes, cams, and every other crazy thing us magazine folk have coerced Westech's Steve Brul to bolt to it. It is the DESIGNED events that yield CENTERLINE. With the first cam loaded in the engine (the 101 LSA) Westech's Steve Brul made three dyno pulls, the average of which was saved to compare to the next cam. Ultimately, it comes down to how you want the engine to run, the car's intended purpose, and what you are willing to tolerate. 110 for sure. 02 The 402-inch stroker short-block combined an aluminum LS2 block with a 4.000-inch crank and 6.125-inch rods. That way you can discuss what you want from the engine and how changes in LSA or any of the other specs will affect how the engine performs. The 114 cam will give more low end torque, good midrange, less power up high. Typically, narrower lobe separation develops peak torque at lower rpm and widening the separation tends to build peak torque higher in the rpm range. by 3V Performance Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:38 pm, Post Also, the wider LSA contributes to chassis stability in drag racing by avoiding the delivery of a ferocious blast of power that would break tire traction. by SStrokerAce Sun Dec 07, 2008 12:22 am, Post Another difference between the two involves the power curve.